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	<title>Comments on: Sholom Keller Speaks Out</title>
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	<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/</link>
	<description>kvetch \KVECH\, intransitive verb: To complain habitually. noun: 1. A complaint 2. A habitual complainer.</description>
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		<title>By: HC</title>
		<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/comment-page-1/#comment-11370</link>
		<dc:creator>HC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 04:47:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kvetcher.net/?p=1373#comment-11370</guid>
		<description>I actually was with Keller in Iraq.  He did nothing like he mentions in his articles.  Keller is not what he says he is.  I was in the Army&#039;s 101st Airborne for 3 years.  Not once did Keller do anything heroic or mentionable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I actually was with Keller in Iraq.  He did nothing like he mentions in his articles.  Keller is not what he says he is.  I was in the Army&#8217;s 101st Airborne for 3 years.  Not once did Keller do anything heroic or mentionable.</p>
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		<title>By: DK</title>
		<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/comment-page-1/#comment-8652</link>
		<dc:creator>DK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 05:28:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kvetcher.net/?p=1373#comment-8652</guid>
		<description>B.BarNavi, Shlomo is a decent fellow, and will take it in stride. In the end, Sholom is a veteran who fought for the U.S. in a terrible war,  and I believe he feels he is still fighting for his country. 

I, for one, believe that he is.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>B.BarNavi, Shlomo is a decent fellow, and will take it in stride. In the end, Sholom is a veteran who fought for the U.S. in a terrible war,  and I believe he feels he is still fighting for his country. </p>
<p>I, for one, believe that he is.</p>
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		<title>By: B.BarNavi</title>
		<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/comment-page-1/#comment-8650</link>
		<dc:creator>B.BarNavi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Dec 2008 04:19:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kvetcher.net/?p=1373#comment-8650</guid>
		<description>So instead of addressing the substance of Sholom&#039;s words, you all try to psychoanalyze him to death.

I wonder what the Anarcho-Rabbi himself will think of these comments.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So instead of addressing the substance of Sholom&#8217;s words, you all try to psychoanalyze him to death.</p>
<p>I wonder what the Anarcho-Rabbi himself will think of these comments.</p>
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		<title>By: WEVS1</title>
		<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/comment-page-1/#comment-7343</link>
		<dc:creator>WEVS1</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Sep 2008 14:56:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kvetcher.net/?p=1373#comment-7343</guid>
		<description>I can&#039;t believe I agree with SP. Most radical political activists (right and left) adhere to what Lee Harris terms a fantasy ideology:

http://www.hoover.org/publications/policyreview/3459646.html

My first encounter with this particular kind of fantasy occurred when I was in college in the late sixties. A friend of mine and I got into a heated argument. Although we were both opposed to the Vietnam War, we discovered that we differed considerably on what counted as permissible forms of anti-war protest. To me the point of such protest was simple — to turn people against the war. Hence anything that was counterproductive to this purpose was politically irresponsible and should be severely censured. My friend thought otherwise; in fact, he was planning to join what by all accounts was to be a massively disruptive demonstration in Washington, and which in fact became one.

My friend did not disagree with me as to the likely counterproductive effects of such a demonstration. Instead, he argued that this simply did not matter. His answer was that even if it was counterproductive, even if it turned people against war protesters, indeed even if it made them more likely to support the continuation of the war, he would still participate in the demonstration and he would do so for one simple reason — because it was, in his words, good for his soul.

What I saw as a political act was not, for my friend, any such thing. It was not aimed at altering the minds of other people or persuading them to act differently. Its whole point was what it did for him.

And what it did for him was to provide him with a fantasy — a fantasy, namely, of taking part in the revolutionary struggle of the oppressed against their oppressors. By participating in a violent anti-war demonstration, he was in no sense aiming at coercing conformity with his view — for that would still have been a political objective. Instead, he took his part in order to confirm his ideological fantasy of marching on the right side of history, of feeling himself among the elect few who stood with the angels of historical inevitability. Thus, when he lay down in front of hapless commuters on the bridges over the Potomac, he had no interest in changing the minds of these commuters, no concern over whether they became angry at the protesters or not. They were there merely as props, as so many supernumeraries in his private psychodrama. The protest for him was not politics, but theater; and the significance of his role lay not in the political ends his actions might achieve, but rather in their symbolic value as ritual. In short, he was acting out a fantasy.

It was not your garden-variety fantasy of life as a sexual athlete or a racecar driver, but in it, he nonetheless made himself out as a hero — a hero of the revolutionary struggle. The components of his fantasy — and that of many young intellectuals at that time — were compounded purely of ideological ingredients, smatterings of Marx and Mao, a little Fanon and perhaps a dash of Herbert Marcuse.

For want of a better term, call the phenomenon in question a fantasy ideology — by which I mean, political and ideological symbols and tropes used not for political purposes, but entirely for the benefit of furthering a specific personal or collective fantasy. It is, to be frank, something like “Dungeons and Dragons” carried out not with the trappings of medieval romances — old castles and maidens in distress — but entirely in terms of ideological symbols and emblems.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t believe I agree with SP. Most radical political activists (right and left) adhere to what Lee Harris terms a fantasy ideology:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.hoover.org/publications/policyreview/3459646.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.hoover.org/publicat.....59646.html</a></p>
<p>My first encounter with this particular kind of fantasy occurred when I was in college in the late sixties. A friend of mine and I got into a heated argument. Although we were both opposed to the Vietnam War, we discovered that we differed considerably on what counted as permissible forms of anti-war protest. To me the point of such protest was simple — to turn people against the war. Hence anything that was counterproductive to this purpose was politically irresponsible and should be severely censured. My friend thought otherwise; in fact, he was planning to join what by all accounts was to be a massively disruptive demonstration in Washington, and which in fact became one.</p>
<p>My friend did not disagree with me as to the likely counterproductive effects of such a demonstration. Instead, he argued that this simply did not matter. His answer was that even if it was counterproductive, even if it turned people against war protesters, indeed even if it made them more likely to support the continuation of the war, he would still participate in the demonstration and he would do so for one simple reason — because it was, in his words, good for his soul.</p>
<p>What I saw as a political act was not, for my friend, any such thing. It was not aimed at altering the minds of other people or persuading them to act differently. Its whole point was what it did for him.</p>
<p>And what it did for him was to provide him with a fantasy — a fantasy, namely, of taking part in the revolutionary struggle of the oppressed against their oppressors. By participating in a violent anti-war demonstration, he was in no sense aiming at coercing conformity with his view — for that would still have been a political objective. Instead, he took his part in order to confirm his ideological fantasy of marching on the right side of history, of feeling himself among the elect few who stood with the angels of historical inevitability. Thus, when he lay down in front of hapless commuters on the bridges over the Potomac, he had no interest in changing the minds of these commuters, no concern over whether they became angry at the protesters or not. They were there merely as props, as so many supernumeraries in his private psychodrama. The protest for him was not politics, but theater; and the significance of his role lay not in the political ends his actions might achieve, but rather in their symbolic value as ritual. In short, he was acting out a fantasy.</p>
<p>It was not your garden-variety fantasy of life as a sexual athlete or a racecar driver, but in it, he nonetheless made himself out as a hero — a hero of the revolutionary struggle. The components of his fantasy — and that of many young intellectuals at that time — were compounded purely of ideological ingredients, smatterings of Marx and Mao, a little Fanon and perhaps a dash of Herbert Marcuse.</p>
<p>For want of a better term, call the phenomenon in question a fantasy ideology — by which I mean, political and ideological symbols and tropes used not for political purposes, but entirely for the benefit of furthering a specific personal or collective fantasy. It is, to be frank, something like “Dungeons and Dragons” carried out not with the trappings of medieval romances — old castles and maidens in distress — but entirely in terms of ideological symbols and emblems.</p>
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		<title>By: Ahavah</title>
		<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/comment-page-1/#comment-7336</link>
		<dc:creator>Ahavah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 07 Sep 2008 19:25:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kvetcher.net/?p=1373#comment-7336</guid>
		<description>You know, I haven&#039;t had sound on my laptop for over a year (it&#039;s integrated, and I can&#039;t afford a new computer).  It would be nice if you could transcribe the good parts of these things when you post them - wishful thinking, I know.  But I can&#039;t be the only person on the planet who has this problem.  Shalom!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You know, I haven&#8217;t had sound on my laptop for over a year (it&#8217;s integrated, and I can&#8217;t afford a new computer).  It would be nice if you could transcribe the good parts of these things when you post them &#8211; wishful thinking, I know.  But I can&#8217;t be the only person on the planet who has this problem.  Shalom!</p>
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		<title>By: DK</title>
		<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/comment-page-1/#comment-7301</link>
		<dc:creator>DK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 13:08:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kvetcher.net/?p=1373#comment-7301</guid>
		<description>I think you guys should ask yourselves if the Arabs truly want democracy. Does it look high up on their priorities? In the off chance that this isn&#039;t what they really want, then what are the odds that we are going to successfully impose it on them?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you guys should ask yourselves if the Arabs truly want democracy. Does it look high up on their priorities? In the off chance that this isn&#8217;t what they really want, then what are the odds that we are going to successfully impose it on them?</p>
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		<title>By: Sholomo</title>
		<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/comment-page-1/#comment-7291</link>
		<dc:creator>Sholomo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 00:13:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kvetcher.net/?p=1373#comment-7291</guid>
		<description>for once i agree with SJ.  One can&#039;t have an opinion just because they didnt fight? And just because someone fought doesn&#039;t make them right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>for once i agree with SJ.  One can&#8217;t have an opinion just because they didnt fight? And just because someone fought doesn&#8217;t make them right.</p>
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		<title>By: SJ</title>
		<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/comment-page-1/#comment-7289</link>
		<dc:creator>SJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Sep 2008 00:00:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kvetcher.net/?p=1373#comment-7289</guid>
		<description>DK, with respect, since when did one have to fight in a war in order to have an opinion on a war? I thought in the United States, the military works for the civilians.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DK, with respect, since when did one have to fight in a war in order to have an opinion on a war? I thought in the United States, the military works for the civilians.</p>
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		<title>By: DK</title>
		<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/comment-page-1/#comment-7282</link>
		<dc:creator>DK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 22:43:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kvetcher.net/?p=1373#comment-7282</guid>
		<description>SJ, stop insulting Sholom. After you fight over in Iraq, you can call Sholom whatever you like.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SJ, stop insulting Sholom. After you fight over in Iraq, you can call Sholom whatever you like.</p>
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		<title>By: SJ</title>
		<link>http://kvetcher.net/2008/09/1373/sholom-keller-speaks-out/comment-page-1/#comment-7281</link>
		<dc:creator>SJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Sep 2008 22:23:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kvetcher.net/?p=1373#comment-7281</guid>
		<description>sholom [deleted by siteowner] keller is really stupid, he is &quot;defending&quot; the U.S. constitution  by trying to make it so that the USA can&#039;t complete its goal turning Iraq from a dictatorship into a democracy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sholom [deleted by siteowner] keller is really stupid, he is &#8220;defending&#8221; the U.S. constitution  by trying to make it so that the USA can&#8217;t complete its goal turning Iraq from a dictatorship into a democracy.</p>
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